&#9;TRUTH AND RECONCILIATION COMMISSION 

&#9;HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS

&#9;SUBMISSIONS - QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS

DATE: 03.09.96 &#9;&#9;&#9;&#9;NAME: MILDRED MTHETHWA

CASE: 1224

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CHAIRPERSON: Mrs Mthethwa, can you hear me alright on the earphones?

MRS MTHETHWA: I can hear you.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much for coming. We want to welcome you very warmly. You are the first person after lunch and people are still coming in, but we have to start because we have other people that we have to hear as well. &#9;You're going to tell us about your brother Bethuel. Before you do that I'm going to ask Jasmin Sooka to ask you to take the oath and also to assist you in telling your story this afternoon. But thank you very very much for coming, you are most welcome. Could you please tell us who is sitting next door to you?

MRS MTHETHWA: It's my cousin.

CHAIRPERSON: I'd like to welcome her as well, we're very pleased that you have somebody with you and I'll hand over now to Ms Sooka.

MILDRED MTHETHWA: (sworn states)

MS SOOKA: Mildred, you're going to tell us about your brother Bethuel, and I'll ask you to tell us your story please.

MRS MTHETHWA: It was in June 1986. The children during that time used to go to the mountains for their meeting next to Location Six. When they were there on top of the mountain, I don't know what they were doing because I did not attend, I was not part of them, I was well grown 

NELSPRUIT HEARING&#9;TRC/MPUMALANGA

 

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but I didn't attend. They went there, it was late in the evening. They went to that place to celebrate the 16th of June. When they were there I don't know what happened on top of that mountain where they met during that time. All I can say now is to give the testimony of what happened to my brother when he came home.

&#9;He was brought home, he was already dead and he was not talking. When he was brought home, I wasn't at home at the time. I was next my sister's house. When I arrived at home, my brother was already sleeping and there was a blanket on top of his body. My father said somebody came, a husband, he knocked at the door. During the time when he was knocking my father opened the door. The man in question asked my father to come to the car to come and identify whether he knows the child. My father agreed, he came and went to the car to look at the child, and he said, "It's my child". 

&#9;The man said, "Can you take this child to your house?" In as far as my father's testimony is concerned, my brother's clothes were full of blood and the man suggested that we'd better take the child to the hospital because the child was seriously wounded. And my father said it wasn't necessary, we can take the child to the house. My father as an old man realised that the child is already dead, it wasn't necessary to take the child to the hospital. 

&#9;In as far as my father's testimony is concerned, the man said he went to the mountain where he got the child and he also lost his child. Since yesterday the children were not at home. The parents went to the mountain just to check for their children where they usually meet. The man claimed he went to the mountain where the children were already

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dead. He therefore took the child, and according to the man there were some of the people staying next to the area. They directed him and they indicated where my brother's home was. That's what the man told my father.

&#9;After that when the child was already found at home. During that time I was also there and other members of the family were already invited to come. When we came home I did touch my brother and found that he was seriously injured. My father therefore went next door to ask to phone so that he can arrange with the mortuary to come and collect the corpse. They later came. When the hearse arrived, the police were following the car. If I remember well, there were plus-minus two cars, SAFAS cars. The hearse was in front. &#9;When the police arrived at home they take the door, they were questioning where Bethuel is, they went here and there until they found him. They kicked him even while he was dead, they continues kicking him. (weeping)

MS SOOKA: Take your time. Would you like some water?

MRS MTHETHWA: When they were busy kicking the corpse, my father was becoming very angry. He tried to fetch something which we could use to fight the police because he was angry at what they were doing to the corpse. He questioned them, how can they kick somebody who is already dead? He therefore asked the police to kill him and when we all saw that our father was angry, we also decided to help our father to fight against the police. We fought against them. The police went out of the house. And my father said the car from SAFFAS and from the mortuary should also return and my father said he is going to take the corpse personally to the mortuary because he is totally against what the police were doing.

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&#9;And the people claimed they don't know what happened. Later the people of the mortuary took the corpse to the mortuary. The police did not stay because we were fighting with them and they took the corpse to the Nelspruit mortuary. 

&#9;During the of the funeral, the police came again. All those days when the people were coming to mourn the police used to come. They use not to enter the house, they were just patrolling next to our home. They came during the day of the funeral, it was during the night vigil. They entered our home, they found that there were many people, even many family members were present and we have already taken the decision as a family, if we die, let's die all. They realised that the family was a radical family, we were all prepared to fight. The police did not do anything that day. They went away.

&#9;They came the following day, Saturday morning. They came to tell us that there must be limited people to attend the funeral. My father replied, "I cannot do your will because the corpse is mine, this is my child, you cannot kill my child then you expect you cannot dictate the terms for me, I'll do what I prefer". That's what my father said and they went.

&#9;During the time when they were to go to the grave yard, the police came and stopped next to the door, to the passage. They were following all the people during the procession. They went on top of the mountain. We were at little bit lower area. They were watching everything from the mountain with their guns. After the funeral they went, they never came again at home, that's what happened.

MS SOOKA: Mildred thank you for telling us that, but I'm NELSPRUIT HEARING&#9;TRC/MPUMALANGA

 

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going to ask you a few questions so that I can be sure of what you're saying. Firstly, tell me where this mountain is. You say that it's next to Location Six. Location Six where and what is the name of this mountain?

MRS MTHETHWA: I don't know the name of this mountain, they usually say it's Shangaan, there is a mountain where the children used to go and meet there. It looks like a park, it's a very beautiful area. 

MS SOOKA: Was your brother a member of the UDF or the ANC?

MRS MTHETHWA: He was a member of the ANC. Because I remember one day, we asked him as a member of the family that he is still having a bright future, he must not involve himself in political activities, because he was going to die. We pleaded with him not to involve himself because he was still young. We told him that he still had a bright future, he can become a teacher, he is going to die if he continues to involve himself in these. We were advising him and he used to say, "I know that I'm going to die, but I know if I'm going to die, the community is going to bury me". Then we failed as a family to win him, because he was aware that he is going to die. But because, even if he was going to die, he told us that he doesn't mind because the community's going to bury him. Then we failed as a family, that we cannot do anything else because this was his personal decision, that he was not afraid of death.

MS SOOKA: On that particular day they were celebrating 

June 16. Did you know what the celebration or the commemoration was going to be?

MRS MTHETHWA: In the beginning I felt I'm going to give the testimony of what I saw. I don't know what they were doing on the mountain, I wasn't even there, I was not part NELSPRUIT HEARING&#9;TRC/MPUMALANGA

 

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of them, I'm giving the testimony of what I saw.

MS SOOKA: Do you know who killed your brother?

MRS MTHETHWA: No, there were rumours that the CABASA group did kill my brother, some ...(indistinct) police.

MS SOOKA: Yesterday Mr Ndlazi testified that his son Sidney was also shot on that mountain on the same day and earlier this morning we had Pendile who had also been shot. Was your brother in their company on that particular day?

MRS MTHETHWA: I hope so because when I could cheer Pendile, I become very angry, it was shocking and they said they were in the house and she said that there was somebody who could assist when there was need for help but I therefore realised that maybe it was my brother who wanted that help and he died because he was shot. The way in which he was wounded, he was even shot while he was already dead. The stomach was totally destroyed with many holes of wounds and this person wanted to make sure that he's dead.

MS SOOKA: You yourself were not present when they held a post mortem?

MRS MTHETHWA: I wasn't there but my elder sister was there, she's a nurse, she was there during that time, I wasn't there.

MS SOOKA: You also say that when your brother was already dead, the soldiers were kicking his corpse, is 

that correct?

MRS MTHETHWA: Yes I said that.

MS SOOKA: Did you see that or did your father tell you about that?

MRS MTHETHWA: In the beginning I clearly stated that my father told me that somebody came to bring my brother. Then later they sent the children to come and fetch us as family NELSPRUIT HEARING&#9;TRC/MPUMALANGA

 

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members. When my father phoned the hearse of SAFAS people from the neighbour I wasn't at home during that time. When the car came to fetch the corpse, the police were following and they came to knock there, I was then present during that time. I am an eyewitness of that.

MS SOOKA: After your brother's death was there ever any kind of investigation?

MRS MTHETHWA: It is puzzling, because when I came to register for the Truth Commission, the guy whom I met when coming to register, then he said I must return and go to the police and find the docket from the police. I said to him, "I doubt if the docket is there." What really the family is aware, is we saw it wasn't necessary to lay a charge or open a case on that, because the police were there. To my surprise, when I arrived at the police, the police gave me the docket number and they also wrote who is in charge of the case. I became confused then. How, because we were never contacted as a family? Because in this case we do not have the information from the police of the investigation or even a court hearing about the case, nothing was done. I question myself, why must I go to the police, because it was my first time to hear that there was a case. I don't know who opened the case, how?

MS SOOKA: Thank you very much.

CHAIRPERSON: Any other questions, Mrs Mkhize? 

MS MKHIZE: When people come to register for their statements to the Commission, sometimes they have got a motive and when you are giving this statement, what is the motive, what do you prefer the Commission to do for you?

MRS MTHETHWA: My brother was killed in a barbaric manner. I wish, if I can know the perpetrator. He needs to come. NELSPRUIT HEARING&#9;TRC/MPUMALANGA

 

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He must come and apologise. You cannot forgive somebody whom you don't know. Somebody whom you don't know who was never in front of you. Then you forgive that person. You can not even know what reason. That person needs to come to you and ask for apology. He needs to state reasons and state whether he was being bribed by somebody to do that, like the Boers, then you can forgive that person. Until today, noone came to us as a family to say, "I know about this, I know that the Devil tempted me". Nobody came to us as a family and admitted being concerned about the issue. I also wish to see the perpetrator, who is he, why he did that?

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much. I'm sure you did answer this question already but I may have missed it. Could you just remind me, how old was your brother when he died. 

MRS MTHETHWA: He was 15 years of age.

CHAIRPERSON: As you know, we have heard today and every day when we have hearings all over the country in every province, of young people who were either very badly injured or were killed, and your brother is such a person.

&#9;Now, what was happening of course, was a terrible struggle between forces who wanted to keep the country as it was and people who wanted change, and many many people 

paid a heavy price, and those of us who now enjoy a new democracy should never ever forget what your brother did and so many others like him. He paid a very very heavy price and I'm sure he didn't know when he was singing the songs and marching on the mountain, that his own life would be taken, but life seemed to be very cheap and many many people died.

&#9;You have told us about the docket. You've said you NELSPRUIT HEARING&#9;TRC/MPUMALANGA

 

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want to know and we are going to try and find out, and if we can we will come back to you and will tell you. Right now I want to thank you very warmly for coming and telling us and sharing your pain with us, it's very difficult, we know that. And I hope that in the telling of the story, something of the hurt, something of the anger will have been helped by sharing it with us, thank you very much.

MRS MTHETHWA: Can I please tell you something. All these children who were victims, they did put the tombs on their graves, I question why my brother did not have a tombstone. I therefore request the Commission to help the family for a tombstone so that we can remember him, because usually on the 15th of June, when we go to look at the grave, usually the others come and clean the graves for their families and usually they forget my brother. I wondered why they used to forget him and his grave is without a tombstone. Can I request the Commission to help in that regard that he gets a tombstone?

CHAIRPERSON: I'm glad that you have raised that and we will certainly pass this on to the Commission, the full Commission. We have to make recommendations to the President as to who should be helped and how they should be helped and some people have talked about one large memorial somewhere in the country, where every name of every victim will be, and others, like you have asked for just a small tombstone to remember people by. We will certainly pass that on and thank you very much for telling us that.

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